S1E12

Oil Tanks to Batteries & Energy as a Benefit: Austrian Startups | TEB-S1E12

with Sebastian Rigger, Roman· Chusen, Sonnan· 79m

TL;DR

Austrian startups Chusen and Sonnan innovate grid flexibility by repurposing oil tanks for thermal storage and enabling energy sharing as a corporate benefit.

Synopsis

Chusen converts disused heating oil tanks into thermal batteries, addressing the challenge of storing surplus renewable energy for heating while repurposing existing infrastructure. This solution targets the 450, 000+ oil heating systems in Austria facing mandatory replacement. Sonnan facilitates energy communities, allowing companies with rooftop solar to share excess renewable electricity with employees as a corporate benefit, improving grid stability and employee retention. Both startups leverage Austria's supportive ecosystem and regulatory framework for energy communities, aiming for product-market fit in Austria before expanding to other EU countries. They highlight the crucial role of innovation, communication, and resilience in navigating the energy transition and bureaucratic hurdles.

Key metrics

by the numbers · 8

450,000
Austrian oil heating systems
15 million
European oil heating systems
4 to 10 cents
PV feed-in tariff
3,000 or 4,000
Austrian energy communities
75%
employees wanting sustainable employer
10.5 billion kWh
Germany renewable curtailment 2023
86%
household energy for heating/hot water
300 kWh
6, 000L tank thermal storage

Topics

8 tags

Thermal StorageCircular EconomyEnergy CommunitiesCorporate BenefitsGrid FlexibilityStartup EcosystemPolicy & RegulationDemand Response

Stats

Duration: 1h 19m
Words: 11.9k
Questions: 76

Timeline

10 chapters

Roman's Energy Sector Entry
Roman describes his academic journey, starting with physics and an internship at Verbund, where he wrote his bachelor thesis on hydrogen production and life cycle assessment.
I2C Program and Co-founder Discovery
Roman explains how he joined TU Vienna's I2C entrepreneurship program, which, despite initial project failures, led him to find his current co-founders.
Sebastian's Path to Energy Efficiency
Sebastian shares his background in mechanical engineering and work experience in consulting and procuring green vehicles for public transportation.
Chusen's Mission: Thermal Batteries from Oil Tanks
Sebastian introduces Chusen, a company repurposing old heating oil tanks into affordable and efficient thermal batteries, driven by circular economy principles and upcoming regulations.
Sonnan's Mission: Energy as Corporate Benefit
Roman outlines Sonnan's goal to combine ecological and economical sustainability by enabling companies to share excess renewable energy with employees as a corporate benefit.
Sonnan's Energy Community Model
Roman details how Sonnan operates through energy communities, allowing companies to sell excess PV electricity to employees via the public grid, leveraging existing regulatory frameworks.
Chusen's Founding and Early Development
Sebastian states Chusen was officially founded in October 2024, following a year of idea development and securing initial funding projects.
Sonnan's Founding Process
Roman mentions Sonnan's idea emerged in March 2024, received its first grant in October 2024, and is currently in the process of official company incorporation.
Sonnan's EU Expansion Strategy
Roman discusses Sonnan's long-term vision to achieve product-market fit in Austria, then expand to other EU countries with established energy community regulations, such as Portugal and Spain.
Chusen's Demand Response Vision
Sebastian explains Chusen's business model, which includes software for predictive control to optimize heating system efficiency and aggregate decentralized systems for flexibility on the energy market, targeting the DACH region first.

Key insights

5 takeaways

01
Repurposing Infrastructure for Storage
Old heating oil tanks, mandated for removal, represent a significant, overlooked resource for affordable thermal energy storage, offering a 20-100x cost advantage over electric batteries for heating applications.
02
Energy as Corporate Employee Benefit
Companies with excess renewable generation can offer green electricity to employees as a corporate benefit, boosting retention and attracting talent, especially among younger generations prioritizing sustainable employers.
03
Austria's Energy Community Leadership
Austria's robust regulatory framework and high smart meter penetration (99%) have fostered over 3, 000 energy communities, making it a leading model for other EU countries developing similar decentralized energy sharing systems.
04
Thermal Storage Addresses Curtailment
With 86% of household energy used for heating, thermal batteries offer a cost-effective solution to absorb surplus renewable electricity, mitigating grid curtailment (e.g., 10.5 billion kWh lost in Germany 2023) and enhancing grid flexibility.
05
Startup Innovation Disrupts Old Sectors
Startups provide essential 'spark from outside' to innovate the slow-moving, decades-old energy sector, introducing new ideas and business models crucial for accelerating the energy transition.

Pull quotes

3 quotes

Our core goal in that sense is to combine the ecologic ecological effect of sustainability with an economical effect. So we want to make the energy transition economical.
Roman
33% of young people refuse job offers if they can't identify with the goals of the company.
Roman
Renewable energy is great but there's a slight downside it more often than not peaks when we need it actually least
Sebastian

Transcript1898 cuesClick a timestamp to jump

Wow. Very welcome to a new episode of
the energy bridge with new equipment.
everything outside. This is no all
transparent. this is our first time
making a interview with two guests
and yeah I feel like a kid using a new
toy to be honest. It's super
cool. How do you feel? How are you?
Yeah, I could tell if you were feeling
like a kid.
>> Yeah, every one of us, I guess.
>> Yes.
>> Yeah.,
>> welcome guys.
>> Yeah. Yeah. Thanks for the invitation.
>> Have you been in an interview or
>> No, for me it's the first podcast. I
I did some interviews obviously, you
know, for the startup and PR reasons.
>> But it's nice to be here. happy to be
here. a first time with such an
professional
equipment to be honest. yeah, I'm
excited, happy to be here as I said.
>> Amazing. Amazing.
>> I don't know.
>> I went to the class.
>> Yeah, go for it.
>> yeah. So, as one friend recommend
us at the beginning of the interview,
we're going to make a context of the
episode. Today we're going to talk about
startups.
here we have a two great exponent of
the ecosystem in Austria. We have
Sebastian Rigger that you are making
a you're going to know what what you
are doing because it's with
circular economy and thermal energy and
I love it. And also we have Roman I
don't know how to pronounce well your
last name but what is ita
>> some somehow liked it but okay it's
perfect
>> okay
>> it's good enough so and well you both
are co-ounders and Roman is working
with
addressing one of the challenge of
energy transition which is like when
you have more energy that you need so
you can have negative prices so how to
use energy
as benefits.
>> Exactly.
>> Okay. Amazing. So, we
>> we got paid by by Roman
>> for the
>> energy bridge definitely gets renewable
energy as a benefit afterwards.
>> Oh, wow. That could be
>> let's see about that.
>> so yeah the idea of this
conversation is to know you. We also
like the concept of people be behind
energy and to talk about what it
means to have a to be co-ounder of a
a startup let's say. so I would
like to start with Roman
afterward or if you want to
>> No, it's totally cool. No, no, I
understand it. It's Roman.
>> I would Roman
No, no, no. But actually both. It's
but to start with Roman, what is
how did you get into energy field? What
did you study? What what have you been
your study journey to get where
you are now?
>> Good question. It actually started a
little bit late. I started out in
grad studying physics in my bachelor's
degree. and at the end for my
bachelor thesis, I started an internship
at Forbund.
One of the biggest, right?
>> Yeah, exactly. one of the biggest energy
providers in Austria., and I wrote my
bachelor thesis in the energy field on
hydrogen, hydrogen production and life
cycle assessment.
>> Wow.
>> Of hydrogen. And after that I thought
maybe maybe the energy field is better
suited for me than the theoretical
physics
>> field. And then I changed to Vienna
where I started my master's program
which is called physical energy
engineering. still in the physics field
but with more focus and more
electives in the energy field and
yeah that's how I got to TU Vienna and
there they also have an amazing
entrepreneurship program and that's how
I could combine entrepreneurship and
the energy field it was not planned but
>> so you [clears throat] are in a spin-off
from tubing
>> it's not a spin-off it's not a research
spin-off but it's a it started from a
student project out of a TUN extended
study.
>> Okay. Program.
>> Are you were at the I2C program?
>> Exactly. Okay.
>> It's from the innovation incubation
center, the extended study on innovation
where you can apply with an idea and
then try to found your startup over the
course of one year.
>>.
>> And it didn't work.
>> But,
>> why not? I, what were the
lessons? I met my two now
co-founders there and we all worked on
different projects
>> with different teams and in the end
there were a couple of different reasons
the team the team members went to
pursue their PhD or they wanted to work
in the industry
>> or things like that and so we the
three of us remained individually in
each of our teams
>> and over the summer we decided to start
the project on our own the three of us.
But that's amazing. maybe the
project itself it was not successful but
you could find the co-ounders which is
>> yeah which is perfect. that's
also part of the scope of this program
that you get to know motivated people
from different domains in the
technical university
>> and that worked out perfectly.
>> Yeah. Okay. So
>> technical challenges.
>> Yeah. Technical challenges
>> most often arise
>> with tech with technical
people like
>> that's
>> I think it was my
>> Yeah. Okay.
>> my fault. Excuse me.
>> Sorry for that.
>> I should
>> I should talk less and give you the
the
>> No, no, no. It's okay. Yeah.
>> No. So,
>> I have to listen to you. I just
>> Now that
>> Yeah, but let's go with
Sebastian. How was yours?
>> Quite similar, I would say. So I came
to Vienna to study mechanical
engineering [clears throat]
at the TV from the western part of
Austria close to the Swiss border. So it
would would take me 20 minutes by car to
get into Switzerland. didn't do that
too often because it's quite beautiful
where where I am from. So I don't had
the border for
>> Yes. So there's a common a common joke
amongst Austrians. Why is it called
foral which means in front of this
mountain which is the alber.
>> Okay.
>> And for the others it seems
like we are behind the mountain because
>> depending where you from where you say
>> from the pers
>> perspective.
>> Perspective that's the word. Thanks.
but for us it's obviously in front of
the eye I guess.
>> yeah and you came here to Vietnam. Yes,
I came here to study mechanical
engineering and I did that and I had
some experience work experience in
the fields of consulting and finite
element analysis as an engineer and I
later I later did some procurement
projects in the public public
transportation sector where I was
responsible for procuring green
sustainable vehicles. So meaning
hydrogen or electric
>> Okay, cool. NG vehicles or the battery
battery electric vehicles BF
>> BV sorry and during the course of
the same studies he did so the
extracurriculum in extended studies on
innovation I met my co-founders and
that's basically
those those different stations
where I got in touch with energy
efficiency and energy as as a broad
>> and you both being in I2C how how
much Did it help you in a way?
>> so I would say it helped us a lot.
it's it's basically the
concept the place where our ideas
were conceived, let's say., it's it's
a lovely program with lovely people
and it's not just that the people are so
social and so great. They also know a
lot. They have a huge knowledge base.
they have a huge network of experts
which they can yes lend to you or
give to you or recommend to you and
without them I'm I'm sure I wouldn't
be sitting here today.
>> Could you extend on what what exactly
happened there like how big is the
program? What happens and all of that?
>> Sure. So it's a two semester 30 ECTS
extracurriculum study and you can
do it besides your studies so master
study or bachelor study or even
besides your your work I think
>> or PhD as well
>> or PhD as well and you get you get in
touch with all bas basically there's a
single batch every year and you get in
touch with all these soon to be founders
and you first share your your ideas
and try to evolve new ideas and then
you decide upon an idea and try to build
a team around that idea [clears throat]
and then you have basically two
semesters where you have workshops and
hands-on hands-on support from those
experts I mentioned and in the
end you have this very big
[clears throat]
pitching competition
>> a demo day which demo day actually right
now
>> which is right now in the
>> from this patch.
>> Yes. So it's happening.
>> When is it?
>> Right now it's started.
>> It's happening.
>> Yeah, it's happening right now at the
same time.
>> And during the course of these two
semesters, you grow together and
you learn lots of skills you
will need afterwards in your daily
lives.
>> Okay. Okay. In the entrepreneurial life
as well especially
>> especially that yeah we are going to go
deeper into the what does it what
it requires to be a co-founder but
maybe you can briefly explain to the
community what is your mission as
co-ounders in your own companies. I
mean to mention the name and the what's
what's the problem that you are solving
and what's the mission because we have
heard this golden circles which is
begins from the why then how then what
so what is the why what is the
mission of your
startups
>> this time this time we could have
Sebastian speaking
>> okay should go on okay
>> I'm sorry for this technical voice
problems So our mission so I'm CEO
at Chusen. We are developing or we are
repurposing old heating oil tanks into
affordable and efficient heat storagees
or thermal batteries., and our
mission, if I had to break it down,
would be that we want to use already
existing infrastructure which is
otherwise being disposed of
>> and just make something better out of
it, make something which can help the
energy transition into a more
sustainable and a greener future. So for
us this means we can we can build
thermal batteries out of things that you
usually would throw away.
>> Yeah. Actually when I heard about it I
was impressed because it's it mixed
circular economy with energy transition.
Yeah. And actually there is a like a
law that it's it's demanding all the
old infrastructure to be retired in
10 years ahead like in 2035. So you're
addressing this point exactly.
>> Exactly. So there's a regulation
which states that fossil fueled
energy systems have to be replaced in a
foreseeable amount of time. as all
these sustainable regulations I would
say they are currently a little bit more
perceived to be flexible. So if the
economy is not going well they will
I think they will push it out a
little bit later but basically says in
the next 10 years at least in Austria
you have to get rid of all the running
oil heating systems or fossil fuel
heating systems. And this is basically
a an accelerator for our
cause idea.
>> Would you say that this this is from
the policy side? So would you say that
that was incentive to start your
startup?
>> yes yes and no. So our team I
would say we're all we can be very
idealist idealistic
and we're quite we live
quite sustainable but the idea was
conceived in the in the cellar of my
co-founder's mother-in-law and she
had or she decided to exchange her
oil heating system also with this
regulation in mind that she has to
change did eventually anyways. So she he
decided to do to go for a heat pump
and floor. So this co-founder he
decided or he asked himself do we
really have to pay lots of money to
get rid of this big voluumptuous
container steel container or could we do
something else with it and that's how
the idea of choose born. Could you tell
me? It's interesting for me to
understand like how how the houses look
like like for maybe several decades
it was just like that they needed the
oil to be there to warm their home.
>> Exactly. So I think this particular
oil heating system or the oil tank is
over 30 years old.
>>., so it's a big steel cubic
container which can hold up to 6, 000
liters of oil. Yeah.
>> And usually you'd or this household at
least would use around 1, 600 L of oil
per year to just heat the object or
the building and the warm
water. And this means you usually
fill it up once every 3 4 years and
and then you just store the oil in
there. But I don't I actually don't
know why they built them that big to be
honest because you could just
get the oil like every second year or
something. But that was their decision
back then. And the
>> and I think I know what what you're
planning or what you want to hear.,
so these tanks, they are that big that
you couldn't just get them in after the
house was built. So you had the tank and
then you built the house around it.
>> Once I took it to take it out, it's
quite tough.
>> Yeah. Yeah. It's it's it's usually not
possible just
so you have to you have to cut it
where it stands. and that's quite
laborsome and therefore very expensive.
>> And how old are those houses where this
being built? Yeah, on average.
>> Oh yeah, that's a good question. I
would say so there was a recent
spike recent I would say in the last 20
years ago a spike in popularity of oil
heating systems because of a gas
crisis if I remember correctly. but
it was back back like 40 50 years 60
years it was the go-to heating
system. when you were living in
remote remote areas. So these houses are
usually 50 60 70 years old.
>> I just have one more question on that.
>> How many how many houses are there in
Austria which need to be changed going
forward?
>>. According to the data, we know
there are at least 450, 000 oil heating
systems still up and running.
>>. alone in Austria and in
the dark region so the German speaking
region in Europe there would be
around like a little bit over 5 million
and in the whole of Europe there's
something over 15 million so there's
hotspots in Germany, Austria, Belgium,
Ireland, Albania,
Spain, France. So that there are rather
remote
>> places that they have many many of these
or heating systems.
>> and the change is from to use
this tank for a heat pump at the end to
electrified. So because the heat pump
is so efficient with u
taking electric energy and turning it
into thermal energy. one one one
>> 1 kilowatt
>> hour of electricity could be
>> three or four
>> two to five
>> two to five depends on the thermal
energy.
>> Yes.. So it's so efficient that we
usually recommend it but there are
other green energy or heating systems
which are also totally viable if you opt
for them. but for us, for Cholulen,
we say especially if you have in mind
that there's so much surplus solar
electricity on the market, it's just
it just makes totally sense to go for a
heat pump.
>> Amazing. So yeah. so
>> we can move to Roman.
He was anticipating for a while. So
>> no worries.
>> Go ahead, man.
>> Yeah. About the mission and the problem
that you are solving. M it's
probably similar to Choulen. We all want
to manage the energy transition and
what our core goal in that sense is
to combine the ecologic ecological
effect of sustainability with an
economical effect. So we want to make
the energy transition economical. So,
that it doesn't to raise awareness
that it doesn't always have to be
that you have to leave stuff out to be
sustainable or to act sustainable, but
that you can actually also get even a
monetary benefit.
>> the definition of
sustainability, it's environmental,
economical, and social impact. You have
to be a business. We are not be naive.
It's
>> Exactly.
>> Yeah. And that's our core goal to put
these three sustainable impacts
together in one thing. And we want to
do that by introducing renewable energy
as a corporate benefit. So for example,
a company that has a huge PV panel on
the rooftop and produces too much energy
during the day or on weekends can
share this excess energy with all of
their employees for and they decide
on the on the price. So for example
in Austria typical household would pay
15 to 25 cents per kilowatt hour of
energy and a typical PV panel that
feeds into the grid would get 4 to 10
cents per kilowatt hour of
electricity. And with what we do,
they can put the price somewhere in the
middle so the company earns a little bit
more and the employees save money and
with that they can save a couple of
hundred euros per year and like this
we want to increase the awareness of the
individual people how a renewable
energy system works when PV electricity
is there like for example today when the
sun shines
>> and when it is available cheap and in
that sense I think it's also great
that we are here together today both
because you're more on the hardware side
it needs the technology part to manage
the energy transition
>> but it also needs the awareness part and
the reaching the people part
>> I want to understand like who are the
people involved if if you could just
define more so a company can put
that as a benefit for their employees.
But how how does the whole value chain
works? Who who are the people involved
in terms of getting it to the grid or
behind it? If you could just explain a
bit more the process.
>> Yeah. So how it essentially works is via
the legal or regulatory framework of
an energy community..
>> So the company is or for example a
company is the owner of a PV panel and
they produce [cough and clears throat]
they produce renewable energy that
supplies their their own site directly
there
>> and the excess energy that they don't
need they can feed it back to the grid
and they normally sell it to the energy
provider
>> for
let's say four to 10 cents that I
mentioned before. So that's what they
normally do and now with this concept
they can directly sell it to their
employees over the public grid. They can
use the public grid infrastructure
that's already there
>> and deliver
the electricity. It's not physically
delivered the line to exactly the
employees but on the spreadsheet
>> it's calculated like that.
>> Interesting. And how aware are people
about this?, in the last couple
of years, since 2020, 2021, there
there's been a real surge in the
foundation of energy communities.
>> Mh.
>> like I think by now we are at 3, 000
or something like that or 4, 000 in
Austria. but still especially in the
urban areas many people don't know
about this possibility to save money and
get energy from from private producers.
>> Could you also just very briefly explain
energy communities?
>> yeah energy community is
basically let's say the four of us start
an energy community. You have a
household or the mother-in-law of your
co-founder at least
>> I don't have
>> with a PV panel as well I guess okay and
let's say they produce too much energy
so we get together we found this energy
community as a legal entity and via this
we can we can now register with the
grid operators so vinaer and it's nest
for example and they do the metering
for us So they take the data on how
much energy each of us consumes and
at what time that happens and when the
production and the consumption happen at
the same time then the energy is
transferred between us. So that's how it
works and then with this data we
can do the billing ourselves or we as
Sonic with our company provide this
service for the energy community. Can I
just
>> ask a question. So, but
sorry, but it's it's not the
same energy, right? Is it's always
only on the balance sheet. So,
is it if if those two houses are in the
vicinity, if they're next to each other,
you actually get the energy which is
produced at that house and you only have
to you only have to pass this
short distance with this energy.
>> Yes. Essentially, it's it's like that. I
mean the electricity always takes the
shortest path between production and
consumption. So if you're
>> basically they say
>> yeah
exactly
so if you're are neighbors then you
might you could even say that you get
that electricity but that's not
how the electricity system works but you
could say it like that but with in the
context of energy communities it's you
can more you can think about it more
like a green electricity tariff for
example we talked about for bunt before
you can buy a hydro power green tariff
from Austria that comes either from the
Denub River or from the Alps, but you
can still use it here in Vienna
because of the certificate system.
You still get green electricity, but
it's still only on the balance sheet
>> because you don't know what the
electricity is. If you live next to
>> then you probably get the
biomass
>> electricity. Exactly. I just want to
add because you were in our first TE
forum last last May and you presented
there and you mentioned another benefit
which is for companies to retain talent
because the statistics says that
more and more people wants to be part in
a
responsible company. Okay. So could you
go a bit deeper on that please?
>> Sure. maybe let's start a little
bit before that. We in the beginning we
started with an energy community in my
hometown. That was two years ago. And
then we found out that this concept
could be more than just sharing the
energy between households and saving
some money and raising awareness. But
and we thought about so many
companies have this excess energy on
their weekends and they get little to no
money for it or even have to pay if they
feed in on the sport market. And we can
do we can do better stuff with already
existing energy that is already there.
and create an additional benefit that
you mentioned for the companies because
especially the young generation wants to
work for a sustainable employer. And
like this we could our companies can
integrate a new form of a corporate
benefit that doesn't exist until now.
and
and can really save them money
because it is known that those benefits
where the employees really get more
money at the end of the month or save
money somewhere
>> are the most attractive.
>> Yeah, true. And we found out about
different studies that say that for
example 33% of young people refuse
job offers if they can't identify with
the goals of the company. There was a
study in the UK.
>> and that's pretty a pretty
clear statement
>> in current job market.
>> In the current job market. Yeah. And
also another Austrian study from
Vilhaben. You might you might know that
marketplace. It's also for chops.
>> Yeah. Marcado li for Latin America
>> or Amazon, right?
>> Yes.
>> Or eBay. EB eBay.
>> Probably like that. And they found out
that 70 75% of employees want to
work for a sustainable employer. And
Yeah, this is one part in how we can
increase that for the company side and
like this create an additional benefit
not only on the employee side with
saving money and on the employer side
that they get more money but also with
by increasing the employee retention
of the companies
>> with existing employees
attracting new talent and branding is a
sustainable employer. to the outside.
>>. Yeah.
>> Might I ask another question? you
said 75% of all
employees or want to be employed by a
sustainable company. Is it only if the
the salary is the same or would they be
willing to lay off a little bit of
salary to get this sustainability
aspect?
>> That's a very good question.
the most important thing is I guess
always the money for employment or at
least that has to it has to fit and then
>> the rights come because that's why they
are benefits and not the main
compensation for your work. So if
you would have to [clears throat] let
go of 50% of your wage every month, then
>> this benefit probably wouldn't make a
difference. But if it's in addition
compared to comparable jobs, then it
might make a difference.
>> Yeah. So there we have Sonic as energy
as a benefit for company and for
employees. So,
>> okay guys, and just going back a bit,
tell us about your company
structure. You both are CEOs of your
company.
>> Yes.
>> And what are who are the other key
people? What are their roles? And if you
could tell us about more.
[clears throat]
>> So, so I think you just had lots of time
talking. So, it's my time.
>>
>> you had enough time asking questions.
Yeah,
such an interesting topic. You had to
Yes. So, I'm I'm the CEO, meaning I have
to do lots of I would say
>> to do the podcast.
>> I have to do the podcast.
>> I have new talent to host.
>> I wouldn't say I have the talent to
host. You guys are doing that great.
It's it's it's awesome. I
[clears throat] have this this job to
do everything
else which the others don't want to do.
And it's not just that. I also love to
do it. so I'm I'm also responsible
for I would call it stakeholder
management. I have to do a little bit
of marketing, a little bit of HR and
everything and combine it. I loved
this multidisiplinary approach to
this to this whole whole thing. I
like it a lot., and the others,
obviously we have a CTO. It's it's Flo,
the guy who who who
had the ID first and saw the first first
oil tank. And, he's he's doing
all the hands-on stuff. Not all the
hands-on stuff, but he
>> God bless her mother-in-law.
>> Yes.
>> Hey, hey, it's it's working. So,
she's happy.
>> Yeah.
So yeah, he's he's a he's a very very
good product developer. He's a he's
very good in manual labor. and
he just has all the skills and the
interests to just go at it and
make it happen. Then we have Kristoff.
He is our I would call him
researcher. He's he's doing a PhD in
control systems and that's basically
what we also have to develop for our
product and that's also what he's
doing u for us. Then we have Stefan.
He's a mathematician
and he's he will be responsible
for everything technical regarding the
software product or software side of our
product. And then we have so those
are the co-founders. Then we have
our brilliant employees which are Poxy
the product development. Laens also
product development. We have Vicki which
is our genius software developer and I'm
missing someone.
>> Wait.
>> No, that's it.
>> Why are you looking at him?
>> Yeah, because he knows
>> because we the same office and I know
the people. How many people then?
>> We're eight people and I forgot
Andreas. I'm sorry Andreas if you're
watching this.
>> [clears throat]
>> So he studied informatics and he's
very handy with electronics. So he's
responsible for the circuit
circuit circuit laying and
the programming of the SPS
systems.
>> Okay, great. And Roman,
>> yeah, we are one person less in the
team. We are seven people right now.
>> we are three co-founders. Lucas,
Jonathan and me. Jonathan is our tech
guy. he studied technical informatics
and has lot of experience in software
development and app development. so
he's responsible for that part also
leading the tech team.
>>.
>> Consisting of two more people now.,
and Lucas is a mechanical engineer by
training, but he's responsible, in
our team for marketing, public
relations, and that kind of stuff.
And I'm, responsible for project
management, as you, said it nicely,
stakeholder management,
>> all the paperwork.
>> I have to say Lucas does a lot
of the paperwork, which is great. Yeah,
he does that very good.
>> By the way, just a small shout out for
Lucas.
>> Brilliant work with presentations
always.
>> Yeah. Yeah. You've already seen that
byen.
>> He's also he's also known in our team as
the slide magician.
>> So, he really does a good job with our
AI., a little bit with AI, but
>> he's one he's a coworker now,
right?
>> Employee of the month every month.
>> Additionally.
>> Yeah. And maybe now we can go through
the personal skills or
characteristics that one co-founder or
entrepreneur have to have what do you
think that are that characteristics
for to be entrepreneurial entrepreneur
>> especially in Austria? Oh,
>> I think for the team dynamics,
one of the most important traits
definitely is to be able to be a good
communicator.
not that doesn't mean that you always
are on the same page, but it means that
you agree to disagree.
>> Okay? So that you can that you have
different viewpoints on different topics
because only if everybody has the same
viewpoint on the same topic you
don't you can't innovate you can't be
innovative.
>> so I think that's one very important
trait. The second one is also you have
to be
maybe you can call it resilient.
especially in the beginning you
guys probably know that as well. You
just start with something, then it's
>> Then you throw it away, then you start
with something new. You probably don't
have money from the very beginning or at
least not a lot of not a lot of it. I
mean, because you said in the Austrian
context here, we have a very good
support system in place with public
grants and research grants that helps
young entrepreneurs a lot. I think
both of both of us
>> have had that. [clears throat]
yeah, would you add anything to that?
>> But at that point, shout out to Austra
Service, Vienna Business Agency, FFG.
Thank you for the support.
>> Wait,
yeah, thank you. Thank you.
>> It needs to be turned off now.
>> You got more money, right? So it could
have gone for long.
>> Yes, there they need to send more than
they get more shout outs and more
clapping. Yes. So I can I can second
that what just said the social aspect
is very important because you always
have to communicate with everybody and
it's just so amazing how much help
and support you get if you just
communicate with the people. It's it's
amazing and it's it's one thing of
the a program and the incubator which I
which I really really
what's the word I'm looking for? I
really appreciate and really value.
it's unbelievable how much support we
already got through them and they
they will not stop supporting us.
>> Yeah. But this is from the external
support. I want to go in the personal
level. What do you think that is your
characteristic that can
>> Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. So I just want
to make a point. You have to be a little
bit you have to be social. Sorry. I was
I was drawn away
>> talking too much again. C CEO
responsibilities
communication CEO remedies
melodies. Melodies that's a word. I
also think you have to be disciplined.
So that helps a lot. and it's it's a
very easy trait to achieve. You just
have to get some routine in the stuff
you're doing and then you basically get
disciplined. And then if you're
disciplined, you can get over the
harshest and most stupendous stuff and
work you have to do. not with ease,
but you manage. And
a big thing, a big part for me at least
is you have to keep it cool and have fun
at what you're doing.
>> Yeah, that's what I wanted to mention as
well. You have to have fun. And I think
that works very good in the office
especially.
>> Yes, that's and it's it's
always easier to have fun if you're
social and if you have the
environment to with for example
these guys in the office. It's it's easy
to have fun.
>> Are you sharing office or?
>> Yes, we are both in the I square C.
>> Okay.
>> The innovation incubation center of the
TU Vienna.
>> Okay.
>> There's a co-working space and we are
both both in there. So we have to see
each other every day
>> but we built up a small
wall so that we also get work done and
not only
is it good to have someone someone to
share experience
>> but you both have seven or
eight people in your team so they
they give you like seven places to sit
and all of that.
>> No, we don't have seven fixed places.
We have three actually.
>> Okay.
>> but we have a good home office policy
and not everybody's full-time. right
now one person Ivonne is working
remotely in Germany. So we don't always
need these seven places. We have one one
office day per week and the other
days there several people are in the
home office.
>> So we actually only have two fixed desks
but one employee
more.
it works out because you have a
seller. Yeah, we have
>> we're not allowed to talk about the
seller.
>> It's private stuff in Austria.
>> so yeah. Yeah. we have the
flexible desk which is nice. And we
also have one one day in the office
actually planned or it's compulsory.
>> Okay. Sorry
that was for the for the seller joke.
Yeah.
but for us [clears throat] actually
everybody just comes to the office
because it's such fun.
>> So now that we are speaking about
teams nowadays how do you deal with
the
strategies to get talent in your team?
How how do you hire people? Where do you
get it from? I think first of all
we always try to get it through the
network also as se mentioned right
before the IQ square is really
supportive and they have a large network
of experts in different field especially
engineers from technical university
>> from different engineering fields. So
we always try to get the talents that
we need from there first and
>> you go to I to
>> we go to IQC we say hey we are looking
for this and that position we want to
fill that and that that gap and then
they post it in their channels
there's also a large group of people of
previous AC students like we are
>> and also researchers that have
participated ated in workshops from the
IQC or tried their own spin-off or
working on their own spin-offs and in
the very Austrian way everybody knows
someone who knows someone who can
>> okay friend of a friend or
>> friends of friends and
>> or a call inside the uni
>> exactly
we call it
>> how how fun it means basically friend of
>> the Austrian way
>> the Austrian way
>> the Austrian way of job marketing
>> okay and in your case,
>> so basically we got everybody out
of the network we already built.
meaning at le
most of the team worked together
already in a different company or
different setting.
>> Mh. And it's it's just so much easier
and faster. But also I think there
there there can be some disadvantages
and it can be dangerous. But if you have
if you're looking for a
position and you have this perfect
person in mind and this person
and it's just a fit and then you have to
go for it
>> and that's what happened with us so far.
So we were quite lucky with that.
>> Okay. Cool. And have you experienced
this there is a term in the energy
sector that not all the companies are
finding the right employees because
now is like a new skills to address
energy transition. Have you experienced
that?
>> we both small startups at the
very beginning. so this this
challenge might come later but until now
we haven't experienced that. And maybe I
want to add something to the previous
question. So the one thing is the
network that we get people from and
the other thing is for example E1 from
Germany now we just posted it on
on LinkedIn and also spread the word
through different channels that
support us and we got really high level
applications
>> of people in the energy field, senior
people that are still working in a
different job but
>> are looking for different experience or
maybe work in a startup that has
>>.
>> maybe some disadvantages but also a lot
of advantages.
>> Yeah.
>> A lot.
>> Yeah. Yeah.
>> And we really got some highlevel
applications and people that said they
they want to work in the energy
transition. They want to do something
that makes sense for them as well. And
they are also willing to do it for
less salary than they have now because
>> Yeah. because starting.
>> Yeah. It's Yeah.
>> But it's the promise of the growing
with you and then to that's like the
idea, right?
>> Yeah. Sure.
>> They can join it from the beginning. So
afterwards
>> Yeah.
>> It's better.
>> They can turn from the beginning.
they can grow with the team with
the mission., and they have it
in their own hands. They can carve the
path.
>> And how long it been for you guys since
you started your company?
>> We officially founded the company in
October last year, October 2024. And we
worked on the on the idea and already
some first funding projects one
year previous to that.
>> Okay. So we did the a program then we
got into the incub incubator and the TV
and incubator for one year and then we
founded the company.
>> So our idea came up in March 2024 and we
got the first alter service grant in
October 2024
>> and we're currently in the process of
founding the company. So we're not yet
incorporated but in the next two to 3
weeks
>> it will be done and
>> I've heard that since two months.
>> I'm actually I repeating that line for
the last three months because you
you talked about how is it in Austria
well
there's a lot of bureaucracy.
>> Oh tell me about
>> Yes.
>> Yeah. So to found your companies are
you going straight away for shares like
flexo or gmbbh or okay or how does it
work?
>> So in our case we're going for the flex
co we also incorporated as a flex co.
Yeah, this is only for the community
because this is a new concept in Austria
from last year that we came across with
this kind of company which is a
flexill company and it's special for
startups because it's lighter let's
say and it have shares so it allows
to have investors or external
shareholders. It's yeah,
>> it allows you to introduce more
different kinds of share classes more
easily.
>> Do you think that that was necessary in
the ecosystem or it was enough with the
GmbH? to be honest the I think
there or what I heard I haven't
experienced it myself because it's my
first company that I founded but what I
heard is that lots of stuff has
already been implemented in the GmbH
framework as well but the flex co now
takes lots of this knowledge and
introduces it in a new form
>> okay
>> so it's easier and it's more flexible
>> so flex Yeah,
>> it's what I heard is it's also the
the new vehicle for the modern
modern companies. So it will be adapted
more frequently. So the newer stuff
you will get through the flex core. Hey,
so just one question out of curiosity
like so when you start
something people don't have a role and
then you evolve into a role but still
not having a company structure how and
you already have about eight people
working for you and there you already
got some grants as well like how does it
go between the team that okay we this is
going to be the role for this person and
how do you define that and how does it
go between the team when you don't have
a structure already from the beginning
and
>> you're working on it almost for a year
and a half.
>>.
>> And now you will be forming a
company. So is it a tussle between
people or it just goes organically? It's
act so far it was quite organically
or organic in the beginning
especially for the for the founders
it there was some some respecting
during the process sometimes you just
realize this kind of this kind of
work is not the right fit for me you
know I just rather do a little bit
more of that and that's also cool if
you just If you if you talk about it
in team and then you can you can
>> re
what's the word?
>> Yeah, you can shift the responsibilities
especially in the beginning in a small
team.
>> But for the employees you usually we
usually have some sort of idea what
they will have to do. but they still
open they're still open to just take
their ideas and maybe evolve their their
role.
>> Okay. and something I was I just
recently read a lot about
self-organizing organization structures.
>> Self-organizing.
>> Self-organizing. Yeah.
>> How does it work?
>> Well, that's a very it's a it's
it's a deep deep topic. I just
it's it means you basically give the
role itself all the power which it needs
to fulfill everything the role has to
do, . there's not
>> freedom or
>> Yeah. Yeah. It means if if you're if
you're someone in a workshop and you
have to you have to drill holes into a
metal metal part every day.
>> then you basically you get
you get the power to get all the all the
tools and just buy them. not ask someone
if you have the budget, but you buy the
tools, you buy you buy the
metal, the work piece, and you just
do your job
>> and yeah, that's basically the
self-organizing part. And
>> what's it called? Just to
>> what it's called? There's different
different approaches, but the
umbrella term would be self-organizing
organization organizations. There's
holocrayy as as one bigger like more
famous one. there's a book about it
as well. I don't want to go deeper
>> and it's something Yes. but it's
something which we want to look into
in the future and take away power
from the higher officials
get rid of CEO CTO and everything and
build roles which are which are closed
in itself but still are part of a of
a bigger thing.
>> Yeah. Wow. W well. We have talk about
flexibility in flexo and now inside
organization and energy transition have
to be flexible. So we are all in the
same page. maybe now to know how
how do you see in the long term your
like now thinking in the future how
do you see your your companies in the in
the long term like plans of expansion or
which countries are you seeing as
potential? You want to start again?
>> No, no, no, no, no, no, no.
>> Go ahead.
>> You go. You go.
>> Perfect. as we are now very
focused on the topic of energy
communities as a tool for our solution.
the possible market is the EU
Europe because here the regular
regulatory framework is already in place
and especially Austria because it's
the country with the best regulation and
the most energy communities in Europe
with it. So right now we are looking
to get product market fit in Austria
>> and then eventually expand to the
rest of the EU countries that have the
regulation already into place
>> who are integrated to the energy
communities. Yeah. Exactly. Exactly.
>> Do you which other countries have
good regulatory framework for energy
communities? There are some countries
with better frameworks and some
countries with less good frameworks.,
for example, Germany is working on a
framework now. But there they have the
problem that they don't have the
metering system.
>> They don't have smart meters. Like in
Austria, we have I think 99% of metering
stations are smart meters. In Germany,
it's probably the 1% that's left here.
It's No, it's a little bit more. Yeah,
>> but they didn't they just pass this bill
that everybody has to get a smart
meter I think in 2025 if I'm not
mistaken.
>> I'm
to be honest I don't know but in 2025
sounds very ambitious. So
>> yeah. No, no, it was passed if if I'm
not mistaken by the 1st of January in
2025. and the homes are obliged to
to get smart meters or I don't know
which which part who has to
deliver all these smart meters and who
has to pay for it. I think energy
providers
>> hope pays for that.
>> Crypto operators probably
>> I think so. But I'm quite sure there's
something on the way at least.
>> Yeah.
>> Or in execution already. Yeah,
there's something in execution since a
long time and has been talked about for
a very long time, but not so much has
happened. But in Austria, it has worked
really well. So here they've done a good
job. And then there's also Portugal
where energy communities are already
getting more and more prominent. Spain
because they have lots of solar power.
Benuks, I heard of Italy has a
little bit of a different concept.,
the Czech Republic, so it's starting to
pop up everywhere. Lots of countries are
looking towards the Austrian system.
What goes into apart from smart meter
for having a robust energy community
system
>> also the regulation on
the geographical
how near the participants can be
because in Austria it's it depends on
the grid level that you are at and if
you are on all of all of them on the
highest grid level then you get also
a benefit on the grid fee so you pay
less grid fee for that and in Italy
for example that's a little bit
different there everything is operated
by the grid operator and they have
the power of it so
>> just apart from the from the measurement
equipment that's the most important
because only with that you can measure
if production consumption is at the same
time and if energy can be shared between
these participants
>> yeah just to know the role of Austria in
the region like CE region
do you think that the other
countries see Vienna as a role to be
copied or or how do you see it?
>> Yeah, I think so because here it works
since 4 years and in some other
countries it's just starting and it's
been a real success here also of
course because of public funding which
is good to get something started off.
>> but now the first push. Yeah. To the
first push and now funding is it's
still good to have funding but it's not
so necessary anymore because it's
working on its own anyway and there's
enough experience and the countries
can definitely other countries can
definitely learn something from the
implementation here.
>> Good. And you Sebastian, how do you see
the future in long term? How do I see
the future expans?
>> So I think I first have to do a little
pitch about our business business model.
So I can answer that question. So we
have
>> Yeah. No, no, no. Go ahead. I will let
you
>> just I'm not doing the whole pitch. The
whole 50 minutes. No,
>> no, the pitch have to be two minutes.
No.
>> Yeah. Yeah. But I'm not doing this. Just
just a business model. so we're not
only doing the hardware component but we
also have the software which is
basically optimizing the consumption of
of the object meaning we or KISS is
developing this modern predictive
control system which according to
research can increase heating system
efficiency by up to 60%
compared to state-of-the-art
regular u control systems.
And when installed at scale, so when
when our system is installed, this
consumption optimization is already
in place. And when installed at scale,
we will take all these decentralized
systems in homes and buildings and
companies and aggregate them together
into a bigger entity to offer
flexibility on the energy market. So
that's our vision. meaning if if the
energy if the grid is has too much
surplus power we can offer this
flexibility to the TSO now I know the
abbreviation but I don't know what it's
standing for
>> transmission system operator
>> yes thank you I was thank you
very much and we get we get
money for that and the customers
will get free energy and some
sort of sharing ing share of the
profit.
>> And so you are going into the demand
respond also.
>> Yes.
>> Good. Super necessary.
>> Yes. Yes. And first we
[clears throat] obviously have the go-to
market in Austria and since the
German region, German speaking region is
culturally similar, very similar.
obviously we will expand to Germany and
Switzerland as they also have a high
concentration on oil heating systems in
Europe and afterwards as as Roman said
the Europe European Union or Europe
itself is it's a very interesting market
for us. I have a question about why
from Austria most of the traffic
goes towards the dark region and not
towards the eastern European side
more towards the Hungary or the Czech
Republic side but I will keep my mouth
shut for that. I'll ask you later
when we delve a bit deeper into
that topic but
>> but you already got into the problem
side of your your solution. tell us a
bit more deep what is the problem that
is existing in the market and how you
come across that okay let's solve this
and how big is the challenge
>> should I start okay
>> yes
>> renewable energy is great but there's a
a slight downside it more often than not
peaks when we need it actually least so
if you have a PV system you produce
most green electricity at midday but
usually you need the energy in the
mornings and evenings. So this mismatch
is really bad actually because the power
grid gets overloaded.
>> for example in Germany in 2023
10.5 billion kilowatt hours of
renewable energy had to be curtailed and
was lost just because it couldn't be
used or stored when it was produced. At
the same time, regulations
leave lead people to get rid of their
oil heating systems or fossil fuel
system. And these include these large
containers which are stored used to
store this fuel. And for us this is a
a resource which which should be used
which can be used as a energy storage.
And if you want to well if you if you
hear energy storage you usually think of
batteries right but batteries are
expensive very expensive per kilowatt
hour it costs more than like 20 to 100
times more than what we are actually
trying to offer and they harm the
environment and more often like always
the technology comes from overseas so
there's a dependency from yeah
geopolitical dependency
>> everywhere is sport importing at the end
>> here in Europe you are only importing
equipment
>> yes exactly exactly and that's not great
right so if we combine all these
problems together and keep in mind
that the vast majority of energy in
households is actually used for heating
and warm water so I think up to 86%
in at least in the central European or
northern European regions then why
would we get so expensive batteries and
not just store heat which makes
perfectly sense
>> so that's what we trying to solve
with one of like the 6, 000
liter tank I mentioned before you can
store over 300 kilowatt hours of energy
>> for how long
>> for how long it depends our
simulations and calculations showed that
usually you wouldn't store it more than
between 24 and 72 hours. So there's
not a lot of heat losses
>> because of this short period of time
time window. But
>> try to get 300 kilowatt hours of
electric battery in your home. Well,
you won't afford it. It's just so just
too expensive.
>>. And then to use the direct use
from this.
>> Yes. So you take you take the surplus
energy from the grid and transform it
into thermal energy and this you will
use in your own home or you can use it
in a local
>> district heating.
>> Yes. Exactly. So
>> or in a local energy community.
>> So
>> that's it's
>> Yeah. Cool. And you what do you think?
>> it's actually the same problem. There
is so much renewable energy that is
there when people at exactly that
location don't or companies or
essentially producers of energy don't
necessarily need it but at other
locations it might be needed. for
example one company that we work with
right now lots of their employees
work in home office all over Austria and
they need energy during the day. So they
just provide with their PV panel that
produces too much anyway on a sunny day
the energy for the employees in their
home office which is great which is a
great benefit.
>> Yeah. So it's similar but less
technical.
>> Yeah.
>> Hardware view.
>> Yeah. I would like to highlight
the role of innovation in energy
transition. how how important you think
it is the startups in this huge
challenge and it's technologically
updated every year. How do you think
crucial is? I think it's very crucial
because the energy sector is one of
the most important sectors there is
because everybody needs energy every
time
>> all the time
>> and it's also a very old sector where
there are lots of structures that have
been in place for I don't know for
decades
>> and a way of working also.
>> Yes. and the way of working and
[clears throat] and not not
everything is public. So
>> or not everything is private. there
are also a lot of public involvement in
that which also makes which is
very important for this sector because
it's it's needed by everyone but which
also makes lots of processes slower and
less innovative
>> and that's why I think new ideas new
startups and new ways into the market
are very important in that sense
>> new energy in the market
>> new energy exactly
>> and you Sebastian what do you Well, yes.
I second what Roman just said. I
think old structures which are
already sit in like an old caution
usually don't
see the need or don't feel like in
innovation and to change anything. So
you always need this this
>> spark
>> spark from outside usually which out
of the box.
>> Out of the box. Yeah. Which just gets
gets people out of out of the
routine to just look outside of
the box to mention the box again. Why
Daniel wanted to ask this question is
that
so innovation is important but and
you also explained about the problem
that you're tackling there has to be
more innovation tackling the same
problem in a different manner. So
[clears throat] what are the existing
solutions which are already tackling the
solution? Do any of those
companies that are already tackling
the same problem but maybe in a
different manner or maybe they could be
your competitor?
>> So yeah, our main competitor are
batteries I would say and I don't know
how many how many battery articles I
get a day in a day in during
summer break when [snorts] nothing else
is in the news. Yes. So,
magical batteries are seemingly invented
every week and I love reading about
that. I'm very much looking forward
to having this problem solved. but
until this is really happening, there
has to be some transition technology.
and not every household or not every
building needs a big battery. so
>> yes there there are other inventions
there are other things which you could
do for example no I don't I don't
want to mention this to
>> but going to data it's the all
energy that we are using 22 23% is
electrical the rest is thermal so you
are addressing most of the problem kind
of
>> yes but you could also turn
electrical energy into thermal energy
right all.
>> Okay.
>> But by the way guys, one interesting
fact like you would not know how it
feels like when you have a that power
cut. I grew up in Delhi and there used
to be big power cut
>> and every household had it we would call
it inverter.
>>. So for the for let's say three or
four four hours the there's a power cut
and in [clears throat] between those
three or four four hours we will have
the inverter we'll turn it on and that's
our power backup. So every household has
batteries back then I don't I
think the situation has changed that
people have started getting 24hour
power
>> but they still I will say most of
the house they will still have some
power backup..
>> I don't know what they are doing it
with it now but there has to be someone
thinking about that problem too.
>> Which which source is this power backup?
>> Is it oil or gas or
>> just like a
>> battery pack?
>> Yeah. Leg battery.
>> Or maybe sometimes also lead battery. I
mean it's poisonous but yeah it was the
one
>> lead acid.
>> Lead acid. Yeah.
>> Yes. yeah. So in this just to be
closing
how do you see in the future which
new challenges can address new
startups in energy sector?
>> Some ideas for the community.
>> Yeah, I think what's currently a
really hot topic because it's very
relevant with more and more renewables
and that's what's popping up all over
the EU. Everybody wants more renewables
is the flexibility topic. M
>> it already exists for the large
players, but for smaller players like
households with oil tanks or now
water
>> heat heat systems it's not accessible
and there's a lot of money to be made u
in that sector because it's a huge
market. So I think that's one very
important asp as aspect and then of
course all the research and
development that currently runs into
storage systems especially batteries or
or alternative kinds of storage like
gravity storage or something. this
might also be a really good topic
>> to go into.
>> Okay. on you, Sebastian, what do you
>>
energy
production generation like nuclear
fishision is still a topic, right?
>> Wow. Yeah. Nuclear in the table again
last months.
>> But I think if that gets market
ready, I think what did they say 2050?
>> yes, I think world be a
better place.,
>> by then you've hopefully sold all the
old oil tanks already.
>> Let's see. Let's see., other than
that, it's a
very hard question to be honest. And I
I think I'm I'm lacking I'm lacking the
the vision.
>> Okay. But maybe you can give an
advice for new entrepreneurs who want to
start in this energy sector. in the
energy sector. Well, you need lots of
energy.
You need you need good friends and
colleagues.
>>.
>> you need to get yourself
acquainted with regula regulations,
regulatories and bureaucracy. There's
lots of it. And Europe
>> patient patience
>> patience patience. and Europe,
every little country has its own
regulations.
It's it's I think very hard, right,
woman?
and never forget the most important
part. Have fun.
>> Good one. Yeah. Always love. Yeah.
>> Live life. Live life love. What is it?
Live, love, life.
this. Sorry. like this meme of bad
motivational posters and live love life
is
I always get it wrong.
>> Okay, maybe we can add it in the video
afterwards.
>> You should have stopped that. Have fun.
>> Yeah,
ruin it.
>> And you, Roman, which advice?
>> Yeah., get the right people around
you that you can really do that with.
and fall in love with the problem, not
the solution. Oh, good one.
>> That's good.
>> Good actually. Okay, one extra
questions., what moves you in
your startups more than the benefit
at the end but internally? What is your
own motivation to do what you do?
>> What we always said in our founding
team, we want to do something that makes
sense. So
>> previously viv in the AC program we
worked on three different ideas. I was
already in energy. Second one was in
with social impact for people with
disabilities and the third one was in
circular economy
>> stuff. So we all wanted to do something
that matters in our sense to make the
world a better place. So that's the one
thing and the second one is
we want we just want to be
live self- sustained and do what
makes fun for us in the team.
>> Amazing.
>> So
>> you
>> yes very good points. I always have
this intrinsic
need to do something which
advances the community. So
>>.
>> community centered I think it
just it basically is the same what
what you said. it's so much easier to
see sense in something which is not
centered on yourself but on everybody
around you.
>> The common good.
>> Yes. The common good.
>>. And for myself, I really really
love to just
experience
new new stuff, new hear new stuff, get
in touch with new people and just
learn.
>>.
>> And I think a startup is
a place where we'll do that every
day.
>> Learning never ends.
>> Yes. Learning never ends. And it
never stops giving.
>> Wow. Amazing. So
yeah, very we're very grateful guys
for having you here today. I don't
know if you want to add something.
>> Yeah, there are many other
questions that we had on the paper that
I think we will have to sit down again.
I think now that we know Sebastian and
he's a cool guy and of you he can come
to our office more often
more so.
But thank you very much guys for
coming here. I think what you guys
doing we know you're doing cool
but also Sebastian it's a
very unique problem that you're solving.
as I said again God bless
the mother-in-law of your
founder.
>> She's still living.
>> God is still going to bless her,
right? Like also when you're
living they it can bless you. But do
you guys want to add something to like
to the community? What what other
pressing maybe stuff that you're
you're working on and how how people can
can look into your work and maybe
something about your demos or
>> your social media. Yeah, as you
mentioned it in the last words, it's all
about the community with you with us us
with Sonic with energy communities and
also with the energy bridge to build a
community in the energy sector. So you
can find us under Sonic on Instagram,
on LinkedIn, on our website Sonic with
triple N s o n.
>> Exactly. Why three ends?
>> Because
Okay. Because it's
>> cooler. No, because we have the triple
benefit for the employees, for the
companies and for the environment.
>> Wow. And sustainable like economical,
social, environmental.
>> Exactly. Wow. Exactly.
>> Magical number. Cool.
>> Cool. And
>> Okay.
>> And you can find them under No, you can
say.
>> In that case, I also do a shout out.
we're on LinkedIn under Cholen. good
luck finding us., it's hard to
it's
>> No, it would be in the video
anyway.
>> Oh, okay then. Just
>> Oh, yeah. Yeah. Oh, yeah. That's good.
You're branded.
>> That's I'm branded. I forgot to
go.
>> Cool. Cool. Cool. Choosen., and what
are the shout out? I forgot right now.
But
>> marketing will kill you.
>> Wait, wait, wait. did marketing
department
and product team.
>> I have to have a serious conversation
with myself after this.
>> Wait, no. There was something
>> there was one funny story where they
wanted to steal our marketing employee
over there.
>> No, no, no. We're not poaching. We're
not poaching.
>> But that's for the next episode. Oh,
good.
>> other than that, there was
something, but I forgot. I'm so sorry.
Okay, we can leave it in the
description.
>> Okay.
>> Okay. We're going to help you. Our
marketing team will help you.
>> Yeah. Okay. So, this is the
>> Sorry, before you close, thank you for
having us. It was a delight. my first
podcast and I don't know if any other
podcast will be as good as this one.
>> Yeah. Forget the first time, you Yeah.
>> So we had a lot of fun as well
with all this setup and of course you
guys
>> and as you as we told you this is the
first time using this setup. So actually
this is the setup or the podcast that
you can see.
>> This is the podcast. This is the podcast
couch. Yeah.
>> The studio. So now
>> we are here in the table.
>> So yeah, thank you very much for coming
again.
>> Thanks.
>> see you around for sure. of course
invited for the second TE forum on
September at Tubing. We're going to
address the four Ds in energy
transition. so yeah, thank you for
everybody to see so far the whole
interview. and yeah, keep tuned for
next episodes.
See you. Bye bye.
>> Bye.

Oil Tanks to Batteries & Energy as a Benefit: Austrian Startups | TEB-S1E12

Repurposing Infrastructure for Storage

Energy as Corporate Employee Benefit

Austria's Energy Community Leadership

Thermal Storage Addresses Curtailment

Startup Innovation Disrupts Old Sectors